Just a passing thought
- Locked due to inactivity on Jun 15, '22 3:54am
Thread Topic: Just a passing thought
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I wonder if the origin of Christmas elves was influenced by the story The Elves and the Shoemaker.
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Okay okay so
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Christmas eleven are derived from a mish mash of different cultures ideas of:
The fair folk
Elves
And similar beings
Specifically the one with the most similarities and direct connections are the
álfar or the huldufólk ( hidden people I think?)
Which are Scandinavian in origin!
But that's because the Álfae are believed to be the original elf
While the general characterisation is a mix of what I stated above
If the elf is mischievous its often being isnpr8ed by the Irish Pooca!
Sorry for info dumping but this is one of my favourite topics -
Yeah, I read that elves were originally of Scandinavian, German, and British origin.
The first mention of Christmas elves was in the mid 1800s in Scandinavia.
But elves were also thought of as slightly devilish, and your happiness was based on how well the elves liked you.
But in the Elves and the Shoemaker, which was written in the early 1800s, there's no tricks or anything, the elves just decided to make the shoes for them for no reason.
And they made little clothes for them not out of fear that the elves would want something in return, but out of thankfulness for helping them.
And you know how stories travel.
So I wonder if it did had some influence with it. I'm not saying it's entirely based on it, or something, I'm just wondering if it had a little influence on it. -
*but before then, elves were thought of as slightly devilish
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And no worries, I like a good discussion!
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So, I'd actually correct you there with Celtic instead of British, but yes!
And I think that's a regional variant, elves were never devilish in my culture, so I think it must be dependant on the belief of the people?
Our elves weren't sweet or soft, but there many stories of them assisting
I'd say Christmas elves take inspiration from house spirits e.g the brownie! -
Also just so you know I'm doing minimal research on this, so you seem to have a great advantage over me in regards to knowledge on the subject
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No worries!
My knowledge is strictly that of celtic mythology and Irish and Scottish history, a little bit of Scandinavian.
Not big on germanic mythology myself -
Yeah, I was a little confused when things were saying British, because there's the Celts and then England couldn't decide who it wanted to belong to, and stuff, so glad for the clarification on that.
Yeah, what I'm seeing is that like there were light elves and dark elves, but it seems to a general thought that they're tricksters. People would leave a bowl of porridge out to keep them safe from the pranks of the elves. I'm thinking food = elves happy because food?
And like if an elf sat on your head it gave you nightmares, hiccups were because an elf wasn't happy with you, and stuff like that.
And if you left a happy life, it was because you had the elves' favor.
Although, porridge is from Germany, so I'm guessing all of this is from the German side of things.
What's a brownie? -
Wait, I remember a series I read a long time ago where brownies were like these evil dark masses that suffocated you during the night
But if you're saying that they were inspiration for Christmas elves, I'm pretty sure the author was letting her imagination run away with her. -
Light and dark elves are a Scandinavian concept, so I believe they share that with germanic belief?
Us celts tend to have a less defined structure for our folk. They're just. Like that 😭
Yeah, sorry but that author had no idea at all what she was talking about.
Brownies are house spirits they attach themselves to a family and tend to the house, and the family.
They can be violent but only in defense of those they are caring for.
Theyre unseen most of the time.
Theyre not bound to us, and can leave if we disrespect them, and often will leave once we no longer need them
But they're not evil or dark masses 😭 -
So what's your reasoning of how they got Christmas elves from brownies?
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Christmas elves are portrayed ad helper spirits, who often make things, and bake sweets. Something brownies are known for.
It's hard to explain in English.
But essentially think of them as house spirits who assist one specific bloodline, the clause's with their daily life ( preparing for christmas)
I dont think their brownies tho
Brownies are only found in the UK and Ireland.
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